Water methanol injection
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Water methanol injection
Hi everyone. So I'm busy with a 1.8 20v turbo conversion in a mk1.
I'm thinking about adding wmi stage 2 into the equation...
Is this a good idea? Is it worth doing? R6400 for a AEM stage 2 kit.
Will this give me some nice gains?
Wmi is something totally new to me. I've watched a couple of videos but I trust your word over YouTube.
All advice is much appreciated. Thank you
I'm thinking about adding wmi stage 2 into the equation...
Is this a good idea? Is it worth doing? R6400 for a AEM stage 2 kit.
Will this give me some nice gains?
Wmi is something totally new to me. I've watched a couple of videos but I trust your word over YouTube.
All advice is much appreciated. Thank you
- Titleists
- Philosopher STIG
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Re: Water methanol injection
WMI requires constant maintenance. It can sometimes be a pain in the butt. Nozzles must be cleaned at least once every 2 weeks if you use it every day-so you must have easy access to the nozzles.
Yes it gives you gains, but marginal. What it rather does is it helps you to be able to run slightly higher timing without having the need to run a bigger intercooler or octane-well on the Mk6 that is the case, might different for other cars.
It drops intake temps a lot, so heatsoak is history with WMI-until you run out of mix.
If you want to go the WMI route, spend your money on a proper kit i.e nice big tank for the mix, on-off switch, something that tells you when the pump is running- you want to be able to see this while you are in the driver's seat. And don't go and buy distilled water at Dischem-battery shops also sell it a lot cheaper in bigger quantities.
If you run a map for WMI, you must also be able to switch the map to lower timing easily if the WMI is not working.
Yes it gives you gains, but marginal. What it rather does is it helps you to be able to run slightly higher timing without having the need to run a bigger intercooler or octane-well on the Mk6 that is the case, might different for other cars.
It drops intake temps a lot, so heatsoak is history with WMI-until you run out of mix.
If you want to go the WMI route, spend your money on a proper kit i.e nice big tank for the mix, on-off switch, something that tells you when the pump is running- you want to be able to see this while you are in the driver's seat. And don't go and buy distilled water at Dischem-battery shops also sell it a lot cheaper in bigger quantities.
If you run a map for WMI, you must also be able to switch the map to lower timing easily if the WMI is not working.
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Re: Water methanol injection
Thanks for your super detailed response! Much appreciated. What is your views on the AEM water methanol kit?Titleists wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 7:23 am WMI requires constant maintenance. It can sometimes be a pain in the butt. Nozzles must be cleaned at least once every 2 weeks if you use it every day-so you must have easy access to the nozzles.
Yes it gives you gains, but marginal. What it rather does is it helps you to be able to run slightly higher timing without having the need to run a bigger intercooler or octane-well on the Mk6 that is the case, might different for other cars.
It drops intake temps a lot, so heatsoak is history with WMI-until you run out of mix.
If you want to go the WMI route, spend your money on a proper kit i.e nice big tank for the mix, on-off switch, something that tells you when the pump is running- you want to be able to see this while you are in the driver's seat. And don't go and buy distilled water at Dischem-battery shops also sell it a lot cheaper in bigger quantities.
If you run a map for WMI, you must also be able to switch the map to lower timing easily if the WMI is not working.
It's a stage 2 kit. The progressive one. It has a on and off switch as well as a indicator for when your tank is low.
If you had the choice to do wmi to your car or use it on something else for your car. What would you do?
Thanks once again
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Re: Water methanol injection
Btw why do you need to clean out your nozzle?
- Killerwatt
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Re: Water methanol injection
Huh clean nozzles every 2 weeks? Thats a bit excessive, never had to clean mine that much.
Gains are dependant on your setup and management. Are you using oem managenent with your swap?
If not then you would need to tune for it. If you run out of meth then just drive out of boost.
The AEM kit is pretty decent. No issues there.
Gains are dependant on your setup and management. Are you using oem managenent with your swap?
If not then you would need to tune for it. If you run out of meth then just drive out of boost.
The AEM kit is pretty decent. No issues there.
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Re: Water methanol injection
I have to agree here. I used WMI extensively and if you're using methanol from the right sources and the right hardware you will have zero issues. AEM is has benefits in cooling, octane and cleanliness of the engine. It's a great modificationKillerwatt wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 9:07 am Huh clean nozzles every 2 weeks? Thats a bit excessive, never had to clean mine that much.
Gains are dependant on your setup and management. Are you using oem managenent with your swap?
If not then you would need to tune for it. If you run out of meth then just drive out of boost.
The AEM kit is pretty decent. No issues there.
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Re: Water methanol injection
Back in the day I was using a D03 nozzle which is quite small and the meth leaves a residue when it dries, thus clogging the system very easily.
Put a decent intercooler with decent throttle pipes and forget about it. Less pain and stuff to worry about. The 10 or so WHP you gain from WMI is small compared to the hassleWalter White wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 8:57 am
If you had the choice to do wmi to your car or use it on something else for your car. What would you do?
- missioner
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Re: Water methanol injection
Before investing in the AEM kit (which is really good), look at alternatives to WMI.
For example, Banks Power use an extra fuel injector with a custom built "adaptor" to spray pure methanol into the charge pipe.
If your plan is to run E85 eventually, then that may be a good solution. Otherwise it may require additional fuel hardware, but I think the gains would be worth it, depending on the application.
One could tie the injector to one of the additional outputs on their Diktator or GoTech. Pulse the injector at a rising rate with the rpms and it should prevent timing pull and a fair amount of detonation. It should also help AFR stay on the safe side with all the extra boost that could added.
Same concept as WMI, but with less hassle in the long run.
Edit: I also agree with previous post. KISS principal FTMFW!
Less complicated means less breaks.
For example, Banks Power use an extra fuel injector with a custom built "adaptor" to spray pure methanol into the charge pipe.
If your plan is to run E85 eventually, then that may be a good solution. Otherwise it may require additional fuel hardware, but I think the gains would be worth it, depending on the application.
One could tie the injector to one of the additional outputs on their Diktator or GoTech. Pulse the injector at a rising rate with the rpms and it should prevent timing pull and a fair amount of detonation. It should also help AFR stay on the safe side with all the extra boost that could added.
Same concept as WMI, but with less hassle in the long run.
Edit: I also agree with previous post. KISS principal FTMFW!
Less complicated means less breaks.
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- PoLonY
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Re: Water methanol injection
Had the AEM setup on my volvo
Zero issues and worked great
Never tuned for it but kept it as a safety net and for the extra cooling rather than the octane per say
Will likely fit WMI to the RS6 due to space limitations for a bigger cooler setup as I can see the intake temps suffering
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Zero issues and worked great
Never tuned for it but kept it as a safety net and for the extra cooling rather than the octane per say
Will likely fit WMI to the RS6 due to space limitations for a bigger cooler setup as I can see the intake temps suffering
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Re: Water methanol injection
Oh that said
The right controller is a must
The old Devils Own controllers used to ground the pump setup, and when they failed they grounded the pump and it ran continuously with the ignition off, flooding the boost pipes and leading to a few cars with hydrolock
That’s why a proper on off switch for the pump itself, using a relay and not just the controller is better idea
Also a proper in line solenoid can help to prevent siphon issues etc over just a one way valve
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The right controller is a must
The old Devils Own controllers used to ground the pump setup, and when they failed they grounded the pump and it ran continuously with the ignition off, flooding the boost pipes and leading to a few cars with hydrolock
That’s why a proper on off switch for the pump itself, using a relay and not just the controller is better idea
Also a proper in line solenoid can help to prevent siphon issues etc over just a one way valve
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Re: Water methanol injection
Tuned for it I was able to gain 25whp from a meth setup. That's 25whp more with a twincooler already on the car bru. That's well worth the money given that you need a little discipline and DIY skill.Titleists wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 9:36 am Back in the day I was using a D03 nozzle which is quite small and the meth leaves a residue when it dries, thus clogging the system very easily.
Put a decent intercooler with decent throttle pipes and forget about it. Less pain and stuff to worry about. The 10 or so WHP you gain from WMI is small compared to the hassleWalter White wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 8:57 am
If you had the choice to do wmi to your car or use it on something else for your car. What would you do?
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Re: Water methanol injection
Yeah the old Devils own controllers were kak. But to be safe always wire them to switched positive not directly to the battery.PoLonY wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 9:58 am Oh that said
The right controller is a must
The old Devils Own controllers used to ground the pump setup, and when they failed they grounded the pump and it ran continuously with the ignition off, flooding the boost pipes and leading to a few cars with hydrolock
That’s why a proper on off switch for the pump itself, using a relay and not just the controller is better idea
Also a proper in line solenoid can help to prevent siphon issues etc over just a one way valve
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Also ran a d03 for years, never cleaned it that often.
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Re: Water methanol injection
It all depends on the file and size of the turbo how much the gains are. On a stage 2 Revo file on k03 turbo, gains are 10whp on pump fuel.Hoosier Daddy wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 1:20 pmTuned for it I was able to gain 25whp from a meth setup. That's 25whp more with a twincooler already on the car bru. That's well worth the money given that you need a little discipline and DIY skill.Titleists wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 9:36 am Back in the day I was using a D03 nozzle which is quite small and the meth leaves a residue when it dries, thus clogging the system very easily.
Put a decent intercooler with decent throttle pipes and forget about it. Less pain and stuff to worry about. The 10 or so WHP you gain from WMI is small compared to the hassleWalter White wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 8:57 am
If you had the choice to do wmi to your car or use it on something else for your car. What would you do?
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Re: Water methanol injection
Thank you everyone for your input. I'm even more confused now because I thought the mass would overrule, but looking at all the comments it seems to be 50-50...
- missioner
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Re: Water methanol injection
Majority are in favour of Meth injection.
Always a good idea to add safety to your setup. With the cost of engine rebuilds increasing as they gain complexity, any and all measures in place that can either prevent failure or reduce the severity of the failure are an absolute must for vehicle that will be subjected to extraordinary driving conditions.
TL;DR
Stock car and normal driving, WMI isn't needed.
Modded car, racing driving DO EET!!!!
Always a good idea to add safety to your setup. With the cost of engine rebuilds increasing as they gain complexity, any and all measures in place that can either prevent failure or reduce the severity of the failure are an absolute must for vehicle that will be subjected to extraordinary driving conditions.
TL;DR
Stock car and normal driving, WMI isn't needed.
Modded car, racing driving DO EET!!!!
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Re: Water methanol injection
That's the agreed starting point. Most keep it there. Cars react differently, so it's nice to play around.Walter White wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2019 5:23 pm Thank you everyone for your input. I'm even more confused now because I thought the mass would overrule, but looking at all the comments it seems to be 50-50...