DSG reliability

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DSG reliability

Post by Jacques venter » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:36 am

Good day Are there any known problems with Dsg gearbox reason asking is Im in the market for a gti secondhand but there are so many different stories as some say they done 160 k km with no problems Is the Dsg problems just hate speech? I couldn’t get any solid evidence on forums etc How reliable is kd04 conversion on a g5 there quite a lot of them floating around Any input will be greatly appreciated I have never driven any of the above I owned 4 golfs and currently a 2016 vivo


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Re: DSG reliability

Post by amstel18 » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:56 am

Jacques venter wrote:Good day Are there any known problems with Dsg gearbox reason asking is Im in the market for a gti secondhand but there are so many different stories as some say they done 160 k km with no problems Is the Dsg problems just hate speech? I couldn’t get any solid evidence on forums etc How reliable is kd04 conversion on a g5 there quite a lot of them floating around Any input will be greatly appreciated I have never driven any of the above I owned 4 golfs and currently a 2016 vivo


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Gearbox ain't the problem. It's all the electronics around it. The 6 speed boxes are a lot more reliable though if oil changes are done every 60k kilos.

The 7speed dry clutch is a different story. Some days it works perfectly and other days gear changes a notchy. Mechatronics units like to fail and clutch packs. Mine has had both new about 30k kilos back and I can feel the mechatronics are acting up again...

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Re: DSG reliability

Post by panic-mechanic » Fri Oct 20, 2017 8:07 am

Like anything it is partly luck of the draw. You See some going on 300k km's and never have issues and you see some giving trouble every 30k km.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Kyle » Fri Oct 20, 2017 8:17 am

panic-mechanic wrote:Like anything it is partly luck of the draw. You See some going on 300k km's and never have issues and you see some giving trouble every 30k km.
100%, a risk that honestly isn't worth it for me purely because of the repair cost.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by VAG Fan » Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:34 am

panic-mechanic wrote:Like anything it is partly luck of the draw. You See some going on 300k km's and never have issues and you see some giving trouble every 30k km.
I am quite shocked that VW/Audi actually put such a product on the market. :eek:
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by panic-mechanic » Fri Oct 20, 2017 10:26 am

Why ? It is an awesome innovation that was followed by every single manufacturer after. Anything new comes with learning, development, redevelopment and eventually reliability. Think how shocking it was when the first turbo cars were introduced. Lots of failures. These days theynare quite reliable and geting better.
There are actually more fsi engine failures than there are dsg gearbox failures yet this one shocks you?
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Kyle » Fri Oct 20, 2017 10:34 am

panic-mechanic wrote:Why ? It is an awesome innovation that was followed by every single manufacturer after. Anything new comes with learning, development, redevelopment and eventually reliability. Think how shocking it was when the first turbo cars were introduced. Lots of failures. These days theynare quite reliable and geting better.
There are actually more fsi engine failures than there are dsg gearbox failures yet this one shocks you?
Good point, and when it works the DSG system is amazing, however it is unfair for the consumer to fit the bill for a substandard product.. If it was any other piece of tech, it would have been recalled / people would have just stopped buying it.

Even worse is that they haven't managed to fix the reliability issues yet...
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by panic-mechanic » Fri Oct 20, 2017 10:41 am

So don't buy one. You also don't appear to have or currently own one so your opinion is based on hearsay instead of actually owning one.
Last edited by panic-mechanic on Fri Oct 20, 2017 10:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by VAG Fan » Fri Oct 20, 2017 10:43 am

I didn't know about the FSI failures either. The one doesn't shock me more than the other. The principle behind all of these failures shocks me. Judge me if you want... :roll:

I simply don't buy new-tech cars, so I wasn't aware how much beta-testing is effectively left to the customer. I thought that car manufacturers spent billions in testing so that a tech platform is more or less mature when it is placed on the market. Apparently that was a naive assumption, and if it turns out to be completely false, yes, that shocks me.

So, if regular failures of a new tech platform are the accepted norm (as you seem to imply), and if this modus operandi is fine with everybody who buys the product, then I'll leave others to pay for all the beta testing and just shut up and drive my old VE110. :hi:

[Edit: reading Kyle's post, it appears I may not be so completely off the mark. ]
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by panic-mechanic » Fri Oct 20, 2017 10:51 am

In any product thof e is only that much time you can test before it is releaed. And no testing can ever truly emulate what happens in the real life market. People modify the engines now the box fails so blame the issue on the box. Ther are service int vals that does not get adhered to. Wrong oil is used, incorrect fill quantities etc. etc all stuff that testing maybe did not take into account.
Modern cars are complex and with ANY product there can be failuers. And as with everything out there you only hear the squeaky wheel ie. The guy thatbhas had a failure that complains. There are 100's of thousands of these boxes out there but they guys that are happy does not come onto forums to report that the box is still ok. You ONLY ever hear of the failures. And often a failure repair gets botched and gues what- the same guy will experience another failure and not the box that has never had work done.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by 175SBU » Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:05 am

Once upon a time there was Windows XP which was stable, then there was Windows Vista which was not stable then there was Windows 7 which was stable then there was Windows 8 which did not have the start button then there was Windows 8.1 with start button but not stable and we now on Windows 10 with more and more operating systems to come which may or may not be stable but we keep on buying, It makes sense what Panic is saying about a Product.

I forgot to mention Windows 2000, Windows Millenium, Windows NT, Windows 98, Windows 95, Windows 3.11 and Windows For Workgroups and other DOS versions. :twisted:
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Kyle » Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:12 am

panic-mechanic wrote:So don't buy one. You also don't appear to have or currently own one so your opinion is based on hearsay instead of actually owning one.
Owned an Audi S Tronic, it failed, and through the process I learned exactly how often they do fail... And saw cars with 20 000kms on them sitting at Audi for months.. Made no difference that they were under warranty since VAG SA has almost no courtesy cars available....

There were very few places down here that wanted to take on the repair, so I had no choice but to send it to Audi, and was without a car for a month, and out of pocket R34000.

It's not something you understand until you actually go through it, with the best case scenario being under warranty and without a car for two weeks(lol imagine paying 500k+ for a car and asking friends for lifts).

So yes the technology is great but they are ticking time bombs and unfortunately not even VAG can tell you how long they should last.. To me that is the definition of a **** product, and I have no idea how you, someone who seems to know the industry quite well, can think otherwise?
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by panic-mechanic » Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:29 am

I am never in that situation. I fix my own stuff and never ask or wait for audi to do or pay for a repair. Hence my expectation or experience with the brand and the dealer chain is entirerly different to what you might or have experienced. I basically never deal with audi or vw Sa and hence have no expectation of whatbthey should repair for free or recall or anything like that. It breaks. I fix it. Done. No expectation that it should have been done for free by somebody because they designed a bad product.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by THANAS » Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:33 am

panic-mechanic wrote:I am never in that situation. I fix my own stuff and never ask or wait for audi to do or pay for a repair. Hence my expectation or experience with the brand and the dealer chain is entirerly different to what you might or have experienced. I basically never deal with audi or vw Sa and hence have no expectation of whatbthey should repair for free or recall or anything like that. It breaks. I fix it. Done. No expectation that it should have been done for free by somebody because they designed a bad product.
But have you owned a DSG and had it fail on you? Because inevitably you would have to deal with the dealerships or some third party unless you are able to repair a mechatronic unit. It's like saying you never go to computer mania because you fix your own hard drives. It cannot be repaired DIY.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by panic-mechanic » Fri Oct 20, 2017 11:48 am

Too cheapskate to own one. They are on cars that i can't afford. But We service a lot of cars where they are on. Very few of them are problematic. The one i own that does have dsg is currently not running. When it is i'll let you know my personal experience with it.
There are already quite a few places you can get dsg parts without having to deal with a dealership.
And generally speaking i'll buy another box that is working of a scrapped car before spending 34k at a dealership.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by billionairebum » Fri Oct 20, 2017 12:23 pm

I cannot afford a R40 000 repair and that is why I do not own one. Simple.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Kyle » Fri Oct 20, 2017 1:57 pm

panic-mechanic wrote:Too cheapskate to own one. They are on cars that i can't afford. But We service a lot of cars where they are on. Very few of them are problematic. The one i own that does have dsg is currently not running. When it is i'll let you know my personal experience with it.
There are already quite a few places you can get dsg parts without having to deal with a dealership.
And generally speaking i'll buy another box that is working of a scrapped car before spending 34k at a dealership.
Yeah I get what you're saying, don't buy a DSG fitted car unless you can pay for a replacement.

I considered buying a used box, but what guarantee does that have, seeing as these units are so fussy... I chose to spend the money so I could have peace of mind knowing that I had a new unit with a warranty and not a R15k paper weight.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by dazza » Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:07 pm

Luck of the draw...you will very quickly know if there is an issue after a proper test drive.
All this being said there are now guys that can fix/refurb the mechatronic units so no need to fork out 30-40k for a replacement
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by THANAS » Sat Oct 21, 2017 9:14 am

dazza wrote:Luck of the draw...you will very quickly know if there is an issue after a proper test drive.
All this being said there are now guys that can fix/refurb the mechatronic units so no need to fork out 30-40k for a replacement
Not entirely true, many of the failure modes are sudden and without warning (for the mech unit). Clutch pack and flywheel issues you are more likely to pick up during a test drive.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Zie_Khumz » Sun Oct 22, 2017 7:02 am

I have a 2008 golf 5 GTi, so far, I have only replaced the seal that was leaking on the box. My car's software is not modified in any way and I comply with the service intervals. I have heard guys complaining about the oil but I I think buying the oil is cheaper than having to fix the box due to oil not being changed. Mileage on my vehicle is currently 249+k.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by SamoVw » Sun Oct 22, 2017 8:35 am

The mechatronics packed up on my audi allroad last year.. The car was on 54000km, thank goodness for motorplan.. The final bill was 60k at audi but that included clutch packs, new mechatronic unit cost, 38k, full gearbox service, new fuel pump and a service. I have had had several vag cars all with dsg or stronic for audi. The allroad was the first issue I experienced, my polo tsi highline was the second.. But just had to replace clutch packs and update software. That costed the dealer just over 12k under warranty.
When the plan ends next year June on my allroad, I will assess if it's time to trade in or extend it. But won't drive a dsg or stronic without a warranty.

Ps the sport zf box on my BMW is awesome.. Not at fast changing as the dsg but much smoother in the lower speeds and gears. These units seem to be more reliable... But that's my observation.. I would take a chance and own one off plan over a dsg or stronic

Apparently the dsg boxes on the 7.5 gen golf's,they seemed to have solved the problem? But we will see....
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by ThatBloke » Sun Oct 22, 2017 11:18 pm

billionairebum wrote:I cannot afford a R40 000 repair and that is why I do not own one. Simple.
Me too, the blind one is one someone clueless buys a vehicle without knowing the potential cost and a month's down the line the box breaks. Even worse is if they bought it Hp and don't have anything in the kitty for expensive repairs.
dazza wrote:Luck of the draw...you will very quickly know if there is an issue after a proper test drive.
All this being said there are now guys that can fix/refurb the mechatronic units so no need to fork out 30-40k for a replacement
If not R30-40k how much?
Which generation Dsg boxes can they work on?

Can't be a whole lot less than R30k because you will need to add clutch packs, even a good old manual box doesn't come much under R15k to repair these days, if you are lucky.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Neuk » Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:36 am

DSG gearboxes are not unlike the PD130 9n Polo Sportline TDi's, failures while somewhat common, were completely luck of the draw. I know of many people who have looked after ther cars well and had no failures, who have looked after their cars and had failures, haven't looked after their cars and had no failures, etc, etc. I decided that when I bought my R I wanted DSG but I wouldn't own it without a full maintenance plan, not only due to the DSG but modern cars in general are exorbitantly expensive to repair. DSG gearboxes are fantastic, despite the failures, the proof is in how widely the concept is used these days by a lot of manufacturers.

Edited: I can typing today.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Kyle » Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:56 am

Neuk wrote:DSG gearboxes are not unlike the PD130 9n Polo Sportline TDi's, failures while somewhat common, were completely luck of the draw. I know of many people who have looked after ther cars well and had no failures, who have looked after their cars and had failures, haven't looked after their cars and had no failures, etc, etc. I decided that when I bought my R I wanted DSG but I wouldn't own it without a full maintenance plan, not onbly due to the DSG but modern cars in general are exorbitantly expensive to repair. DSG gearboxes are fantastic, despite the failures, the proof is in how widely the concept is used these days by a lot of manufacturers.
Yeah having a maintenance plan really does make life easy, although I had little faith in my car (and the technology) after the failure I experienced. You go from a car you'd jump in and drive 700km without even stressing to wondering if you're going to make it to work.

I really do like the technology and the 7 speed in my Audi was epic when it worked, probably the best daily I've owned... But cars that still have manufacturer warranty are still to expensive for me.
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Re: DSG reliability

Post by Neuk » Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:10 am

Kyle wrote:
Neuk wrote:DSG gearboxes are not unlike the PD130 9n Polo Sportline TDi's, failures while somewhat common, were completely luck of the draw. I know of many people who have looked after ther cars well and had no failures, who have looked after their cars and had failures, haven't looked after their cars and had no failures, etc, etc. I decided that when I bought my R I wanted DSG but I wouldn't own it without a full maintenance plan, not onbly due to the DSG but modern cars in general are exorbitantly expensive to repair. DSG gearboxes are fantastic, despite the failures, the proof is in how widely the concept is used these days by a lot of manufacturers.
Yeah having a maintenance plan really does make life easy, although I had little faith in my car (and the technology) after the failure I experienced. You go from a car you'd jump in and drive 700km without even stressing to wondering if you're going to make it to work.

I really do like the technology and the 7 speed in my Audi was epic when it worked, probably the best daily I've owned... But cars that still have manufacturer warranty are still to expensive for me.
There in lies the issue with many peoples views on a maintenance plan, it helps financially but does very little when you are stranded next to the side of the road. I wouldn't own a new modern car without it though, repair costs are just crazy.
Nic

Current Garage:
Daily Drive: 2014 VW Touareg 3.0 V6 TDi R-Line
Project Fes: 1982 VW Golf GLS 1.5
Project FeO: 1966 VW Type 2 Transporter Kombi Split Window

Previous Garage:
Roxy: 2015 VW Golf R
Vagon: 2005 Audi B6 A4 1.8T (140kw) Avant
Project XXXX: 1967 VW Type 3 Variant (Squareback)
Project Betty: 2005 Polo 1.9 TDI (PD130) Sportline
Weekend Warrior: 1993 Volkswagen Caddy 2.0 16v ABF on ITB's
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