Miss On 2.0L 8V

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Herschel
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Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

I recently done my 2E motor over in my 05' CiTi Golf,but since i've started the car 3 weeks ago,the car has miss & sometimes backfires through the intake.
I've checked the timing & all is in order. Car is running on Dicktator std.

I replaced the plug leads,dizzy cap & rotor today,but the car still does the same.

1.Could it be the coil,although i tried a spare coil but don't know the condition of that one & it does the same thing?
2.Water temp sensor maybe.although my heat gauge & temp reading in Dicktator's software seems to be working correctly?

Any thoughts?
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

Does anyone know what the secondary coil ohm reading supposed to be on the MP9 3 pin coil?
I'm only getting a reading of 3000 ohms on both the coils i have.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by panic-mechanic »

backfire through the intake is normally a sign of too slow timing.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

panic-mechanic wrote: Tue May 01, 2018 7:19 pm backfire through the intake is normally a sign of too slow timing.
I've tried advancing the timing more,but doesn't help. I'm starting to lean towards the coil being faulty,cause when the car is under load,it starts jerking/spluttering.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Scatman »

I doubt it would be the coil - are you dead sure your cam and ignition timing are 100% correct?
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

Scatman wrote: Wed May 02, 2018 9:57 am I doubt it would be the coil - are you dead sure your cam and ignition timing are 100% correct?
Yes,everything is spot on.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Was Dicktator tuned?

Agree with panic that it is timing related. Most likely your timing map on ecu, due to you saying timing marks are correct.

Post a picture of your timing and fuel maps that is on ecu. Did you check fuel pressure?
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

PapaJo wrote: Wed May 02, 2018 2:24 pm Was Dicktator tuned?

Agree with panic that it is timing related. Most likely your timing map on ecu, due to you saying timing marks are correct.

Post a picture of your timing and fuel maps that is on ecu. Did you check fuel pressure?
I haven't checked fuel pressure but did remove the injectors with the fuel rail to see if it's all spraying the same.

What i have noticed is that the plugs are burning black,as if the car is over fueling,but it doesn't smell rich ,because it's the same map that's on the car from before i done the motor over. It killed 2 plugs.
If i check the plugs tips,it looks almost as if there's no spark,although there is,because the motor wouldn't run of course.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Incorrect timing value at a specific rpm or too much fuel or fuel pressure dropping at the point where you get this problem.

??? Weak spark, how is the condition of the spark plug leads and what type of leads are you using? Solid core, copper core or silicone carbon type?

Post pictures of your timing and fuel maps for us to check for abnormal or possible areas. Also tell at which RPM this is happening.

You have redone motor after killing two plugs. Are you observing black plugs now on the same two cylinders where the previous ones were killed?

Was injectors checked for flow or swapped between cylinders?
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

PapaJo wrote: Wed May 02, 2018 4:55 pm Incorrect timing value at a specific rpm or too much fuel or fuel pressure dropping at the point where you get this problem.

??? Weak spark, how is the condition of the spark plug leads and what type of leads are you using? Solid core, copper core or silicone carbon type?

Post pictures of your timing and fuel maps for us to check for abnormal or possible areas. Also tell at which RPM this is happening.

You have redone motor after killing two plugs. Are you observing black plugs now on the same two cylinders where the previous ones were killed?

Was injectors checked for flow or swapped between cylinders?
I synced the map with the distributor = No backfire ,but car sounds like it has dead spot.

I replaced the spark plug leads (Bougi Cord) in the week,along with the distributor & rotor = No change from original parts.

Only started killing the plugs after the motor was done :cry:

I'm even beginning to think there might be a problem on the head.

Timing

Image

Fuel

Image
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Timing map seems to be in order. Just change on the 0% column the 750 and 1000 rpm values to 10 - 12 degrees.

Fuel I would say is maybe too much on low rpms from 12% onwards.

Was this the tuned map from before motor redone? Check your duty cycle on injectors for the highvalue set areas.

Take out injectors with fuel rail and perform a flow/ volume test on them. Mark the two injectors that kills the plugs to not forget which ones they are.

While you have the injectors and fuel rail out do a pressure test on the fuel rail to see if there is internal cracking.

Looks more like fueling killing your plugs as you said plugs are black.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

I have checked your map pictures again last night. I have some doubts that this map is correct and was correctly tuned before. The highlighted areas on your map pictures are not looking right at all.

Image

Image

That is most likely what is killing the spark plugs. The timing normally progesses in a rising fashion with rpm and throttle increase and in some cases timing retard slightly at the top end of the rpm range. Fueling also should not take a dip if surrounding blocks are higher.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

That map isn't a dyno tuned map.
The car was tuned with a 276 cam in,but had the jerking below 2000RPM & was pinging like crazy.That's the reason i done the motor over.

The thing is,that map,was the map i used after i took the cam out of the car & detuned the fueling & never had any issues with the spark plugs dying.

I did check the fuel injectors spray pattern before & they all seemed identical. The car will go for dyno tuning soon,but just wanted to drive the motor in ,in the mean time.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Ok, start your first (0%) column on fuel map with a value of around 1,850 ms and then add ,300ms per % column to your map up to 100%. That would give you a starting point and not too rich. Injector ms increases from low rpm to higher rpm in value and in relation with throttle % increase. 4000 rpm is normally around 22-24 degrees, put from and idle on 10-12 degrees. 3250 rpm 18-20 degrees, 2500 rpm 15-17 degrees and 1750 rpm 14-16 degrees will give you a starting point to work from. Higher than 4000 rpm, you can add 1 to 2 degrees per rev range on.

If at any stage you experiencing pinging, back off on the throttle and adjust timing anf fueling in that area. The aimis to have the dot on the cross hair.

If you are still batling, pm me your whatsapp number and enail address and I can send you a map that is starting up and drivable, but not fully tuned.

Did you calibrate the TPS 0% and 100% settings?
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

Yes,the TPS is calibrated.

Thanks for the offer. I'll be busy on the car this evening again.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Herschel wrote: Fri May 04, 2018 2:33 pm Yes,the TPS is calibrated.

Thanks for the offer. I'll be busy on the car this evening again.
Ok, let us know how you get on.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Any update?
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Herschel »

Got the car better.
No more misfiring through the intake,but still has a bit of jerking in the rev range. Might just need to be dyno tuned to get rid of that.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Herschel wrote: Mon May 07, 2018 6:42 am Got the car better.
No more misfiring through the intake,but still has a bit of jerking in the rev range. Might just need to be dyno tuned to get rid of that.
Great stuff.

Show latest fuel and ignition maps and tell where in rev range are you still experiencing jerking to help you smooth it out more until you take it for dyno.
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by Drunkenduck2990 »

Hi guys . I need so help with my 2door golf I'm building up .
Ii have a 1.8 8v motor . Yamaha R1 itb's and a very light can . 63mm exhaust . And a dicktator std . I want to run the motor in b4 the dyno . Can anyone help me with a good map .just to run the car for a while please .
WhatsApp number 0713489152
Email donnigrobler@gmail.com

Any help please
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Re: Miss On 2.0L 8V

Post by PapaJo »

Drunkenduck2990 wrote: Mon Aug 17, 2020 9:41 pm Hi guys . I need so help with my 2door golf I'm building up .
Ii have a 1.8 8v motor . Yamaha R1 itb's and a very light can . 63mm exhaust . And a dicktator std . I want to run the motor in b4 the dyno . Can anyone help me with a good map .just to run the car for a while please .
WhatsApp number 0713489152
Email donnigrobler@gmail.com

Any help please
Load the startup map from Dicktator and startup first. Make sure car starts and udle and there is no water leaks etc. Guys are not dishing out maps easily.

Start your own rides thread and ask me about setting it up, if you need help in setting this up.

What is “and a very light can”
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